--- Log opened Wed May 28 11:02:16 2008
wwoodsunfortunately the wiki no longer allows raw HTML11:02
wwoodsso our old meeting notes on the wiki are all broken11:02
jds2001maybe we could have someone take notes?11:02
wwoodsI've got my own notes from more recent meetings11:02
jds2001i can fix some of that11:02
jds2001there's something that does HTML to MW tables11:03
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jds2001not perfect, but better than nothing11:03
wwoodsI'll post notes from this meeting to fedora-test-list afterward11:03
wwoodsraw logs should go somewhere but I don't think the wiki is the best place11:03
* mdomsch_ did a FTBFS run last week; 350 failures on x86_64, 321 on i386; 5702 SRPMS in total11:04
jds2001yeah, there's talk about having a logbot in here that can automagically post stuff.11:04
jeremysomeone posted a script to do irc logs -> mediawiki formatting on infrastructure-list11:04
jds2001yeah ianweller did i think11:04
mdomsch_I haven't mailed out results as I need to teach my scripts to do the recursive FTBFS bug following11:04
wwoodswtf. alarm just went off11:04
jds2001he just hacked irclog2html11:04
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jds2001mdomsch_: anything that shows up two months in a row probably needs some attention.11:05
wwoodsno idea what that was. anyway, sorry11:05
wwoodsmdomsch_: FTBFS?11:05
mdomsch_jds2001, that would be most of them :-(11:05
jds2001failure to build from source11:05
mdomsch_aka my  "rawhide rebuilds"11:06
wwoodscoffee has not reached the abbreviation-parsing part of my brain yet11:06
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mdomsch_my question for fesco needs to be "if they aren't fixed before F10 alpha, do we drop them?"11:07
wwoodsmdomsch_: are those results on f-d-l or anything?11:07
mdomsch_wwoods, not yet11:07
mdomsch_I like to list the packages that have bugs filed11:07
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jds2001mdomsch_: my vote is yes, but that doesn't mean anything :)11:08
wwoodsI'm in favor of dropping packages that can't be rebuilt11:08
mdomsch_but with the new FTBFS bug, that becomes a recursive operation11:08
mdomsch_which I haven't mastered in bugzilla querying yet11:08
wwoodsif we can't rebuild a package, we can't (easily) fix bugs in it11:08
jds2001what is the intersection of FTBFS and the what's left on the gcc4.3 trackers?11:09
mdomsch_jds2001, not sure, as I made FTBFS block on the trackers...11:09
mdomsch_hence the recursion11:09
wwoodsare there keywords / whiteboard tags on those auto-generated bugs?11:11
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jds2001they all start with FTBFS and block the FTBFS tracker11:12
wwoodsit'd be pretty easy to search for bugs with 'FTBFS', then check all those components for bugs with 'failed massrebuild'11:12
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wwoodsanyway, yeah, let's say that Official QA Position is that packages that can't be built should be dropped if the maintainer can't fix them by.. Beta?11:13
wwoodsmdomsch_: is that an appropriate deadline?11:14
jds2001we'll have to make an exception for things like GCC upgrades and such I guess.11:14
jds2001but then we have to balance that with the fact that we have non-buildable packages.11:15
wwoodsgcc upgrades?11:15
jds2001say the gcc4.3 thing - it'll happen again :)11:15
jds2001maybe not for F10, but at some point in the future.11:16
wwoodswell, yeah, but when it happens we give people a few *months* to fix the problem11:16
mceplyeah, and my colleague is now planning libtool upgrade -- we will have a lot of fun ;-)11:16
wwoodsnot to mention the fact that we have key gcc / glibc developers providing docs and assistance11:16
wwoodsleaving a package unbuildable for several months without any effort is inexcusable11:17
wwoodscertainly exceptions can be made for stuff that turns out to be really tricky11:17
mdomsch_exceptions, but for a limited time...11:17
wwoodsbut only if the maintainer has at least *attempted* to fix the problem11:18
jds2001We should take over FESco with QA folks since no one else seems to be interested :)11:18
mdomsch_we can't expect people to have a F6 chroot much longer11:18
wwoodsheh! oh yeah, forgot to nominate myself for FESCo11:18
wwoodsalthough I already get a vote as QA lead, which kind of makes me a de-facto board member 11:19
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wwoodslet's talk about the wiki for a bit11:21
-!- wwoods changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: Fedora QA | wiki gardening11:21
jds2001all of the testcases need to be fixed.11:21
wwoodsI've been gradually repairing dead links ["Page/Name"] -> [[Page/Name]] here and there11:21
wwoodsbut, yeah11:21
wwoodsthere's a lot of stuff that's no good anymore11:22
wwoodswhat's wrong with the testcases?11:22
jds2001they just all say 1. instead of of 1, 2, 3, 4 etc11:22
jds2001not a huge deal - but nested lists (if we have any) are the fail.11:22
wwoodsis it all numbered lists, or just nested ones?11:23
jds2001all numbered lists aren't numbered right.11:24
jds2001nested lists are epic fail11:24
wwoodsso, yeah, we need to do some cleanup11:25
wwoodswhich is fine, since a lot of those QA pages were getting old and out-of-date anyway11:25
wwoodsso, yeah, start with QA and work your way down.11:25
wwoodsWe probably need to fix the TestCases / TestPlans category pages too11:25
wwoodsSo I'm going to be working on sprucing up the wiki quite a bit, I think11:26
wwoodsare there any areas that we really need better documentation on?11:26
jds2001well, we need some stuff on snake11:26
jds2001and probably pungi-in-mock as well.11:27
wwoodsmm, yeah, SNAKE docs would be good.. as part of the Release Testing stuff11:27
* jds2001 has written the pungi-in-mock stuff on my blog, but it probably needs cleaned up, etc.11:27
wwoodsthat also falls under release-testing11:27
wwoodsI think we might need some bodhi-for-testers docs too11:27
wwoodsI wonder if we can get some wiki metroids 11:29
jds2001im sure we can11:29
wwoodsnew pages created, old pages edited, etc.11:29
wwoodsI'd definitely like to give people some serious positive karma for writing new testcases 11:29
jds2001User ID:1511:30
jds2001Number of edits:3511:30
jds2001so they're already kept somehow somewhere11:30
wwoodsI'll talk to the infra/websites team about it11:31
wwoodsonce we figure out how to get good metroids from our major work areas11:32
wwoodswe'll need to put together some leaderboard / stat tracker deal11:32
jds2001And the testcases should get bonus points for coming with ks snippets :)11:32
wwoodsor maybe that just needs to be part of FAS11:32
wwoodsoh def11:32
jds2001is it possible for snake to do a modular kickstart?  i.e. I want this piece, that piece, and the other piece merged together into one ks.11:33
wwoodsoh ho11:33
-!- wwoods changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: Fedora QA | SNAKE magic11:34
wwoodsoriginally (in snake-0.8), yes11:34
wwoodswe didn't use kickstarts at all - the templates were python scripts that generated kickstarts11:34
wwoodsand there were "plugins" which were python snippets that ran when the kickstart was being generated11:34
wwoodsand did stuff like: if tree.timestamp < XXX: commandline.append("noipv6")11:35
wwoodsor similar11:35
jds2001hmm, that's a bit of a higher barrier to entry to writing them, but why di d it change?11:35
wwoodsto mutate the kickstart/commandline based on properties of the tree/ks/machine11:35
* jds2001 needs to learn python - I just need to sit down and do something productive with it.11:35
wwoodsit was too complicated for anyone to write templates11:35
wwoodsso we ditched it11:35
wwoodsbut! jlaska has been talking about adding the plugin support back in11:36
wwoods(and support for python templates)11:36
wwoodswe also needed to break the plugins into two pieces - the condition and the action11:36
jds2001if you could have some doc that says "this is how you write templates for a non-python wizard" that would be doable.11:37
jlaskawwoods: yeah, we had a good bit of template development internally ... but it was removed from the upstream code11:37
wwoodswell, the goal would be to use plain kickstarts as templates11:37
wwoodsbut then have plugins to mutate them11:37
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wwoodsit'd be nice to be able to have one plugin that appended something like: "%post echo export SNAKE_SERVER=my.snake.server > /etc/profile.d/snake.sh"11:38
wwoodsto every generated kickstart11:38
wwoodswhich we *used* to have11:38
jlaskawwoods: plugins aren't really needed anymore11:38
wwoodsbecause I keep needing to add stuff to all my kickstarts11:38
jlaskaat least ... there may be alternatives that I've been using11:38
wwoodswhat're the alternatives?11:39
jlaskaadditionally ... trees and machines can all accept custom cmdline args (and RFE kickstart)11:39
poelcatwhat is the difference between a 'kickstart' and a 'template' ... or does it even matter?11:39
jlaskapoelcat: they both produce the same thing11:39
jlaskabut come from 2 different "source codes"11:39
jlaska1) being a plain/text file11:40
jlaska2) another being a python script that returns a snake PyKickstart object11:40
jlaskaif that makes sense11:40
jds2001oh, btw i just realized something11:41
jlaskapoelcat: one method is dead simple and another provides programatic flexibility by-way-of python and pykickstart11:42
jds2001i added RHEL to my snake server - does Fedora anaconda silently ignore instnum or bomb on it as unknown?11:42
wwoodsjlaska: okay, so how do you solve the problem of wanting to add a new section to all kickstarts generated by your snake-server?11:42
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jlaskajds2001: F-8 and newer ignores "key" iirc11:42
* jds2001 hasnt tried yet, but that's a great plugin11:42
jlaskawwoods: use %ksinclude with your txt templates, and I add a logic to my snake PyKickstart RHEL base object11:43
wwoodsjlaska: RSN we're going to want to add, you know, a %pre that starts up a log-monitor11:43
wwoodsjlaska: but you still have to add the %ksinclude line to all your kickstarts11:43
wwoodsso if you want, you know, default install with log monitoring and default install without log monitoring11:43
jlaskapotentially ... unless you've previously defined that11:43
wwoodsthat's two separate ks entries11:43
jlaskait's all how you want to define your inventory of kickstarts11:44
jlaskaI'm open to adding back in the plugin stuff if demand requires it ... but we can talk implementation specifics on #snake or in snake trac tickets if you like11:45
wwoodswe'll talk more about that some other time11:45
wwoodsI go back and forth on the plugin thing, and right now it seems very useful11:45
jds2001in reality, there is one ks snippet per test case11:46
jds2001and you can execute multiple test cases with one install, obviously11:46
jlaskawwoods: there's a ticket in the works on adding yum-style snake-server plugin support which would be more flexible and scratch the itch you're referring to11:46
jds2001it helps to be able to abstract that.11:46
wwoodsyou could just do %ksinclude default-pre.ks in all kickstarts, and default to having an empty default-pre.ks11:46
jlaskawwoods: bingo ... that's what I've done as well11:46
wwoodsbut I don't know where default-pre.ks would live11:46
wwoodsanyway, yeah, we'll talk later11:48
wwoodsso this week's priority remains: wiki cleanups and improvements11:48
wwoodsanything else we should discuss?11:49
-!- wwoods changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: Fedora QA | misc.11:49
wwoodsI'm gonna take that as a "no"11:50
wwoodsthanks for your time, dudes11:50
-!- Topic for #fedora-meeting: Fedora QA | misc.11:50
-!- Topic set by wwoods [n=wwoods@nat/redhat/x-938128b5b7436216] [Wed May 28 11:49:36 2008]11:50
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* quaid waits one more minnit15:01
* ianweller lurks15:02
Sparksquaid: I added a few specifics to the agenda so I wouldn't forget15:02
quaidianweller: wise :)15:02
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* jsmith is half-here15:03
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quaidok then15:04
* quaid gives one more minute so he can catch his breath15:05
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* quaid had to get headphones, Harry Potter battling death eaters on audio CD in the back ground is distracting15:07
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-!- quaid changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: FDSCo mtg -- welcomes15:07
quaid... and welcome15:08
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quaidroll call for easy record keeping, if you are here ...15:09
quaid<- Karsten is here15:09
SparksEric Christensen15:09
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* quaid is getting agenda up on his screen15:10
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jmbuserJohnBabich the psychic15:10
* ianweller lurks15:10
quaidok, I saw couf join15:10
quaidand jsmith is half-here15:10
quaidstickster_afk is at a booth or dinner or something15:10
* jsmith wishes he were eating dinner15:11
-!- quaid changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: FDSCo rollin' in the hood -- Elections!15:11
quaidcool, we have everyone here to discuss elections, governance, and the like15:11
quaidpaul posted a bit on list15:11
* quaid waits a moment for others to read the thread15:12
SparksThere was also some additional conversation that was had but it didn't go much further15:13
quaidsome differeint ideas there, ditt and sparks15:13
quaidwhat I propose is this:15:14
quaidi. we discuss until :35 at the latest15:14
quaidii. see if we have a consensus15:14
quaidiii. if not, push the discussion contents back to the list and continue15:14
quaidI started the whole thing off because we are looking at how we govern in Fedora, and I think it makes sense to review on a subproj basis if we are following a formula that works for us or not15:15
* quaid could talk for 20 minutes if he isn't careful :)15:17
quaidsimple idea:15:17
quaidhow do we turn from "the leader" into "a leader" and "A group of leaders"?15:17
jmbuserWe already seem to have a pretty motivated group of people15:18
jsmithquaid: People don't learn to lead by watching a leader.  They learn to lead by having adversity thrown at them15:18
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jsmithThe person you call "the leader" is simply the one that's experienced the most adversity, and done the best at getting through it15:19
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quaidwhat is interesting to me is this ... we have a process we've defined, and we have a way we've grown organically ... and they don't necessarily match15:19
jmbuserThis is not that unusual15:19
quaiddo we fix the process then?  dissolve it?15:20
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SparksIn my opinion, I think the Steering Committee is too bulky for where I see the DocsProject is currently at15:20
jmbuserPlanned processes and the way things actually work out are usually two different things15:21
quaidspoleeba: you might want to throw in here -- discussing governance of Docs, how to work with SIGs, etc.15:21
jmbuserThe solution is to have the process reflect reality15:21
quaidspoleeba: or you might rightly say, "not my place, proceed" :)15:21
SparksIf we defined a chair and a vice-chair I think they could "steer" the process15:21
quaidreality is -- interestd people show up at a meeting time, on list, etc.15:21
quaidSparks: I see that, as a group, Fedora appreciates where there is a named leader or two or three so people know who to "go to"15:22
SparksBut I don't think we have the following necessary for a committee to lead the project15:22
* jsmith agrees15:23
quaidoh good15:23
quaidthat's how I've been feeling :)15:23
jsmithIn fact, I'd gladly give up my seat on the said commitee15:23
quaidthe committee weight is a bit heavy to maneuver with15:23
jsmith(as I've been practically worthless lately)15:23
quaidmake it "opt in"15:24
quaidyou want in, you are in15:24
quaidyou want out, just say you are disappearing for a while15:24
quaidand let people "breathe" that way as per their life15:24
SparksThat works15:24
quaidI've been fortunate to have more Fedora time now, but I've always had weeks or months where I disappear into RHT work15:24
SparksWe, as a project, should be able to say "we want this"...  and we already do, really15:25
quaidas for picking chair/v-chair stuff ... ideas that occur to me are:15:25
quaid* have that as a general subproj election15:25
quaid* have the opt-in FDSCo do it for everyone else15:25
quaidsorry, that was 1 and 215:25
jmbuser"Is Fedora Docs going to remain a project or become a SIG?" is the question to ask, in my opinion15:26
quaid3. don't elect, just make sure things move around often enough15:26
quaid4. don't elect but have a clear process to kick out people who become tyrants15:26
* jmbuser is always out of phase lately - sorry15:26
quaidjmbuser: now, there is a way to ask that question, but I think it is already answered15:26
jsmithLet me throw out one other question... is this a case of "much ado about nothing"?15:27
quaidI support the general scheme that spoleeba (Jef) has proposed.15:27
quaidin that one, Docs is clearly a subproject15:27
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quaidand each SIG has a docs role to fill, with that person connecting back up to Docs the subproj15:27
jsmithI mean, has the FDSCo really been that bad?15:27
quaidjsmith: not bad, just ...15:27
quaidjsmith: we said we'd have elections and stuff15:28
jsmithquaid: And we have... at least I think I got elected somehow15:28
quaidjsmith: so we need to be clear what we are doing, for those in the proj but not involved in leading, etc.15:28
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quaidjsmith: I mean, it's time again for elections :)15:28
Sparks+1 to quaid's list...15:28
quaidturnout has been not very big nor grown across elections; in fact, I think it might have declined15:28
SparksI think we should "elect" or "appoint" a leader of some sort15:28
quaidhow about this as a scheme:15:29
jsmithFSSCo senate?15:29
quaid* FDSCo is opt-in, consisting of all who want to be involved in steering15:29
quaid* FDSCo has the charge to make sure leadership remains relevant15:29
quaid* FDSCo decides to elect or appoint15:29
quaid* If project members have problems with any of that, the answer is obviously to opt-in to the process and help from within the steering15:30
* quaid is thinking it looks OK and quite a bit like what we do already :)15:30
SparksIt is... only less strict... more flexible15:31
jsmithquaid: And yes, if you become an evil tyrant we'll kick you out ;-)15:31
jmbuserIn that anyone who wants to be on the steering committee generally gets elected, it doesn't seem to be much different15:31
* quaid is happy we found a way to make Sparks' vote official, too :)15:31
jsmithbe right back15:31
jmbuserthan what you propose15:32
quaidjmbuser: right, except we artificially constrained the SCo before, so people who cannot be active are "taking slots" from people who can be active right now; so yeah, better15:32
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RodrigoPadulahello guys!15:33
jmbuserIn other words, people get elected, then their life situation changes, then someone else becomes active between elections?15:33
spoleebalet me ask this.. do you have a handle on the number of active people are in the fas groups you think should have a say in the direction of docs?15:33
quaidI don't think so15:33
quaidthat said,15:33
quaidmost such people tend to come in there anyway in some fashion15:33
quaidbut we are not well represented from certain groups15:34
spoleebais that number big enough to support an election? elections on make sense if you need representative governance..versus referendum15:34
spoleebaif sigs grow doc roles...then maybe you'll need elections of some sort15:35
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quaidwhen it gets to where we have some actual contention to elect against :)15:37
quaidright now it's like a girls club electing "officers"15:38
quaidwhich was important15:38
quaidback when we needed to make it clear RHT wasn't puppetizing things15:38
jmbuserWhat about high-level decisions like not documenting closed-binary workarounds?15:38
quaidnow that we all know that RHT barely notices Docs (j/k ...15:38
quaidjmbuser: where it's not clear from the overall project, SCo should be able to handle that15:39
jmbuserEncouraging FOSS solutions instead?15:39
quaidwell, if in the future that becomes OK to do in Fedora, we'll follow suit.15:39
quaidI mean, Fedora doesn't support closed binary workaround, so we don't have to, and really shouldn't15:40
quaidif we do our job right and are visible enough, the rest of Fedora will make sure we don't drift, too :)15:40
quaidok, we went over the mark15:41
quaidbut I think we got some consensus, yes?15:41
jmbuserplease sum up15:41
quaidok, let's see ...15:42
* jsmith stumbles back15:42
quaid12:29 < quaid> * FDSCo is opt-in, consisting of all who want to be involved in steering15:42
quaid12:29 < quaid> * FDSCo has the charge to make sure leadership remains relevant15:42
quaidadd to that:15:42
quaid12:29 < quaid> * FDSCo decides to elect or appoint15:42
quaid12:30 < quaid> * If project members have problems with any of that, the answer is  obviously to opt-in to the process and help from within the steering15:42
quaidFDSCo elects or appoints leadership as they see fit.15:42
quaidand what I propose:15:42
quaidall FDSCo members say "I am a Fedora Docs Leader"15:43
quaidand we emphasize points of contact that are subject matter focused rather than one big daddy15:43
quaid(that is a grow-to strategy that includes better DocsProject pages to help others find their SME)15:43
quaidSME == subject matter expert15:44
quaiddid I miss anything?15:44
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* jmbuser is starting to "get it"15:44
jsmithquaid: You forget that we're going to elect you puppet dictator for life15:45
jmbuserAll hail, quaid!15:45
jsmithquaid: But other than that minor issue, you've hit the issue squarely on the head15:45
quaidhey, I have an ego, too15:45
Sparksquaid quaid quaid quaid15:45
jmbuserMIB II reference :-)15:45
quaidanyone who says they aren't proud of their roles in Fedora is probably lying :)15:45
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jsmithquaid: I'm not proud of my role on FDSCo... does that count?15:46
SparksSo that went twice as long as was "allowed"... :)15:47
quaidanything more?15:48
-!- quaid changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: FDSCo mtg rolls onward -- release notes 9.0.2-115:48
quaidanyone here know anything?15:48
* jsmith doesn't know *anything*15:49
quaidmdious isn't here, it's middle of night in .au15:49
quaidstickster_afk is dining still15:49
* quaid is joking, he doesn't know15:49
quaidok, moving on15:49
jsmith~hail gluttony!15:49
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-!- quaid changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: FDSCo is as FDSCo does -- Wiki gardening ...15:49
quaidlet's make this the final topic for now15:49
quaidoh, sorry15:49
quaidSparks had some stuff too15:49
SparksNot really... It can wait.15:50
quaidSparks: are those sub topics to wiki gardening?15:50
coufpong, sorry15:50
quaidif you say yes, then go ahead, that's as good a place to start as any15:50
SparksOkay...  So wiki gardening...15:50
-!- quaid changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: FDSCo is as FDSCo does -- Wiki gardening ... UG, SecG, Other, cleaning up projects list ...15:50
SparksI've been making a run through the DocsProject and Documentation pages...15:50
quaid(it's been going pretty well, IMO, thanks to all who have been helping)15:51
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Sparksand I think I've hit most of the 'big' pages...15:51
quaid+1 sweet15:51
Sparksbut if you want to see how many pages are actually attributed to the DocsProject...15:51
Sparksjust go to https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Category:DocsProject.15:51
SparksThis brings up my first request...15:52
tiagoaoalet me see if I can talk here15:52
tiagoaoayep.. not moderated, see?15:52
Sparkstiagoaoa Go ahead15:52
quaidSparks: we can have categories in cats, right?15:52
Sparksquaid: We can have anything we want.15:53
SparksLooks like Drkludge wrote something for our category...15:53
quaidtiagoaoa: if you are having trouble talking in a #fedora-* channel, the channel topic there should point you at directions for registering your nick.15:53
quaidSparks: what are you thinking about for cats?15:53
Sparksso that if anyone clicks on the category it will give them some information on what it is.15:54
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SparksThere seems to be two...  DocsProject and Documentation15:54
quaidthey are different15:54
quaidone is content useful for people, the other is the project that maintains that content15:54
SparksIf we can flag all the Documentation as such then it would make it easier to maintain and have people find it15:54
quaidtrue that15:54
Sparksquaid: exactly15:54
quaiddo we want to move the actual docs out from the DocsProject cat?15:55
SparksI'd like to propose we also do one for the drafts.15:55
quaidwhat about a namespace?15:55
Sparksquaid: I don't know.  That was one of my questions15:55
quaidDocs: or something15:55
quaidianweller: can we have a page in multiple, non-nested categories?15:55
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quaidianweller: or should we have a Documentation cat, and a DocumetationDraft sub-cat?15:56
Sparksquaid: yes...  Check the security guide.15:56
ianwellerit depends on how you want to do it. do you want your drafts in [[Category:Documentation]]?15:56
quaidok, I see15:56
jsmithGotta run again...15:56
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ianwellerif not, make them separate; if so, add [[Category:Documentation]] to the page for Category:DocumentationDraft15:56
quaidianweller: yes15:56
Sparksianweller: cool... hadn't thought of that.15:57
quaidthat seems clear enough15:57
quaidSparks: +1 to the general idea, fwiw15:57
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SparksYeah, just trying to get a standard out there15:57
quaidI want to see us leading others in how to use MediaWiki to our advantage15:57
Sparksthe cats make it VERY easy to maintain things15:57
quaidianweller: what is the advantage of a Namespace: over or alongside a Category: ?15:57
quaidSparks: can you write up a policy?  DocsProject/Categories or something15:58
quaidpolicy/procedure/guideline whatever15:58
Sparksthat's not a problem15:58
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SparksAnyone have anything else?  If not I'll go on to the orphan pages and that will be it for me15:58
quaidI want to talk about namespaces but need to grok it better15:59
quaidso we can move on to orphaned, sure15:59
* quaid reading http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Help:Namespace15:59
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SparksSo this page shows all the pages in the wiki that aren't linked to any other page in the wiki15:59
quaidoooooh, nice Special: page15:59
ianwellerquaid: i'm trying to search for what would be a good reason to completely switch over to namespaces15:59
SparksLots of fun stuff in here.15:59
quaidwow, there are tons there16:00
quaidfor the MoinEditorBackup, ianweller or someone was looking at a way to mass delete them16:00
SparksYeah, and if they aren't linked some how then they are only going to be found by a search which to me is inefficient16:00
quaidthat one is on the Migration Masters to-do list16:01
quaidSparks: well ...16:01
quaidSparks: one thing about MW is search is useful16:01
quaidSparks: also, they might be linked from the outside, which is legit16:01
quaidI'd want to see a cross between this list and a Google frequency of some kind16:01
SparksI'm not saying we should go in and try to shoehorn all these pages in, but there are a lot of DocsProject files out there that need some love16:01
quaidto use it as a basis for declaring orphans16:01
quaidthat is true16:01
SparksI agree16:01
quaidok, we are out of time16:01
SparksYep, the orphan thing was just food for thought.16:02
quaidlet's move this over to #fedora-docs to continue, a policy will take more discussion.16:02
quaidok, then, cool16:02
quaidthanks everyone16:02
-!- quaid changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: blank for next folks16:02
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-!- quaid changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: /topic Channel is used by various Fedora groups and committees for their regular meetings | Note that meetings often get logged | For questions about using Fedora please ask in #fedora | See http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/FedoraMeetingChannel for meeting schedule16:05
quaidI bet the EMEA Ambassadors are busy right now :)16:05
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jmbuserquaid: what happened?16:06
quaidjmbuser: LinuxTAG?16:06
quaidI just reckoned many of them are physically together16:06
jmbusermeeting still on?16:07
quaidjmbuser: oh, sorry16:07
quaidjust noticed you dropped16:07
quaidjmbuser: we are done with th emeeting, just ran :02 over16:07
* jmbuser disappeared without a trace16:07
quaidI'll get the raw log out right away16:07
jmbuserquaid: Thanks16:07
quaidthen i can use the new irclog2html.py -s mediawiki to setup an mw table :)16:08
jmbuserThat's the solution I gather16:08
quaidit looks good, i converted our last three meeting logs to it16:08
jmbuserAll my old IRC logs are useless, then? - see 200716:08
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quaidno, not useless16:10
quaidjust showing raw HTML instead16:10
quaidto be honest, I think it's not highly important what we discussed last year in that level of detail16:11
quaidthe onlist summary is usually accurate and easier to find16:11
jmbuserlet's continue this in Fedora-docs16:11
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tiagoaoaGood work, everybody16:28
tiagoaoalet 's hit the bar16:28
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xm4nwhats the topic tonite?23:38
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